Monthly Archives: February 2010

Running the Numbers

Earlier today, I made the claim that I felt like “[Bloodcrushers are] more resilient than Bloodletters.”  3+/5+ vs. 5+.

I took a moment to doodle out the math.  I don’t fetishize Mathhammer or anything; there are a lot of factors that it can’t weigh (and likely just as many factor’s I’m too lazy to try to include), and it’s sloppy statistics.  It’s inevitably built around flat percentages, no accounting for standard deviation, &tc.  It’s another tool in the toolbox, though.  A quick and dirty way give you an idea of whether something’s better, or worse, or about the same… even if it doesn’t immediately appear that way.

Anyway, the numbers:

For starters, 1 Bloodcrusher clearly cannot eat as many bolter shots (as good a metric as any) as 8 Bloodletters.  But he’s 2/3rds as resilient for less than 1/3rd of the cost.  Still, I was wrong about that.

Bump it up 2 ‘Crushers, though, and they’re still considerably cheaper and we’re talking something much more resilient… even before factoring in Would Allocation Shenanigans (which I have no doubt can be calculated, but it’s been a few years since I took a discrete math class).  They’re also possibly killier (another claim I probably need to verify).

I think that, instead of running 3 ‘Crushers in my list from earlier today, I’m probably only going to run 2 in a single unit, just in the interests of kill points.  The points left over from not buying the third will go towards Icons and Fury on some models, I think.

Shrinking the List

Just learned that the Madicon 40K tournament is going to be 1,500 points.

Now, there are a few things I could probably say, but I think I’ll leave it at: “1,500?  Really?”

Of course I haven’t thought through a 1,500 point list.  I’ve thought through a 1,750 list that I can sort of ham-fistedly bloat up to 1,850 and 2,000… but nothing a 1,500 points.

On the one hand, this is vexing.  On the other hand, this is an opportunity to run a list that’s somewhat tuned instead of a tuned list (as I consider my 1,750 list to be) plus points wasters.  I’m going to choose to be positive about this.

So, give me your opinions!

The first cut is my 1,750 list – 250 points.  Fundamentally, that’s going to describe all of these 1,500 lists, but this is the most direct path.

I drop the Bloodcrushers entirely, as well as Karanak and an Icon.  I pick up a Fury of Khorne on the larger Bloodletter squad to hit 1,500.

MAXIMUM KHORNAGE
Chaos Daemons – 1,500 points

HQ
Bloodthirster
Bloodthirster

Troops
Bloodletters x16 – Icon of Khorne, Fury of Khorne
Bloodletters x8

Fast Attack
Flesh Hounds x8 – Fury of Khorne
Flesh Hounds x8 – Fury of Khorne

Heavy Support
Soul Grinder – Phlegm
Soul Grinder – Phlegm

Pros: I can run this right now.
Cons: Bloodletters suck, and having fewer units does me no favors.

This next list is very similar to the previous list: it just splits the big Bloodletter squad in half.

MAXIMUM KHORNAGE
Chaos Daemons – 1,500 points

HQ
Bloodthirster
Bloodthirster

Troops
Bloodletters x8 – Icon of Khorne
Bloodletters x8 – Fury of Khorne
Bloodletters x8

Fast Attack
Flesh Hounds x8 – Fury of Khorne
Flesh Hounds x8 – Fury of Khorne

Heavy Support
Soul Grinder – Phlegm
Soul Grinder – Phlegm

Pros: I can run this right now.  More targets than the list above.
Cons: Bloodletters remain the weakest unit in the army.  8 is really fragile, too.

I can’t tell if this final list is The Way to Go or Silly.

Instead of paying for more Bloodletters than the bare minimum, I can buy Bloodcrushers.  They’re the cheapest thing I can put on the table (while sticking with the powers-of-two number scheme of 0, 1, 2, 4, 8, 16 that Khorne likes), and feel like they’re more resilient than Bloodletters (I’ll do the math, later, to see if that’s true or not).  They’re also More Units, which means More Targets, which makes the overall army that much more resilient.

I could shift the Bloodletter upgrades onto the Bloodcrushers. Not sure if I want to do that or not.  If I do that, I’ll have to model up and paint another Bloodletter.  (Only have one octet without an Icon.)  Without doing that, I think I can fudge the Fury, unequipped, and Instrument Bloodcrushers as just regular ‘ol Crushers.

MAXIMUM KHORNAGE
Chaos Daemons – 1,500 points

HQ
Bloodthirster
Bloodthirster

Elites
Bloodcrusher x1
Bloodcrusher x1
Bloodcrusher x1

Troops
Bloodletters x8 – Icon of Khorne
Bloodletters x8 – Fury of Khorne

Fast Attack
Flesh Hounds x8 – Fury of Khorne
Flesh Hounds x8 – Fury of Khorne

Heavy Support
Soul Grinder – Phlegm
Soul Grinder – Phlegm

Pros: More targets!  More resilient targets!
Cons: Bloodcrushers have A Reputation for being really ‘Ard and Killy, so this could look bad.  I don’t think that’s they’re going to be too hard and killy run on their own, however.

What do people think?

Painting Progress – 20100224

I got a lot done over the weekend but, thanks to training, I’ve gotten nothing done this week.  Fortunately, that means I’m actually pretty much on schedule (yay!) instead of somewhat ahead of schedule (boo!).

I stuck the wings on the rest of my Daemon Princes, and did the greenstuff gap filling on them.  In retrospect, I’m really glad I did this with resin wings: I was able to reshape the wings to better fit the backs of the minotaurs in ways I simply couldn’t have with plastic or metal wings.
I also based the Daemon Princes, and put Rubber Steel on their bases, as well as Karanak’s.
Spent the bulk of the weekend powering through the Bloodthirsters.  If I’d been able to finish them, I’d be a week ahead (I expected it would take me two weeks to paint both of them, instead of just the one).  I’m close: I need to do a couple of details here and there, as well as do the flesh highlighting on their wings (non-trivial), and that’s it.  Pics when they’re done (maybe Friday, I hope).
On another note, Jay and Bill, have started up a hobby gaming podcast.  If you’re into that sort of thing, you should certainly give it a listen.

Bits Suggestions

I need a head.

Specifically, a head that could be converted to look like Benjamin Franklin’s, in ~28mm, without too much sculpting.  An angry Ben Franklin head is not only acceptable, it’s preferable.

Any ideas one where to look?

Painting Progress – 20100217

I’ve made some progress… and had a setback.

I wrapped up Karanak in no time at all over the weekend.

I can’t help but feel like I need to get him with a bit of blood somewhere, but I’m not quite sure where.  It’s low priority to me, though: I can always come back and do that later.  I’m also waiting on some more Rubber Steel to show up in the mail so I can transport him in the drawer.

As noted in my last post, I’ve started on the Bloodthirsters.  The model is… making it difficult for me to motivate myself to paint them, but at least it feels like I’m making progress on them… unlike the Soul Grinders which seemed to live at the “drybrush Shining Gold” stage for forever.  I doubt I’ll have them finished by this weekend, but I’d like to get them most of the way there by then.  That’ll leave me with the Bloodcrushers (and the Daemon Princes).

Last week, I’d mentioned that I couldn’t think of a good way to put wings on the Minotaurs/Daemon Princes. Conveniently, Casey had some Tyranid Wings he needed to get rid of.  That’s great, because it means my “Daemon Prince – Mark of Khorne, Death Strike, Instrument of Chaos, Iron Hide” x3 can become the equally unhealthily expensive but significantly more useful “Daemon Prince – Daemonic Flight, Iron Hide” x3.

I’ve already stuck one pair on one of the Minotaurs.

They went on with extremely little work.  A pin in each wing, plus a tiny bit of green stuff to smooth things out.  I think I probably still need to come back through and do a bit more gap filling with greenstuff, but I’m pleased.

I did hit a minor setback last night, though: I got a game in last night (vs. Tyranids, got tabled) and, while bringing my stuff into the house, the foam tray with the Soul Grinders sitting in it (still need to do actual foam trays for transporting them) tipped over.  They fell, and some legs broke off.

Repairable, but I’d rather it hadn’t have happened.

Anyway, progress from this morning (discounting the totally painted but needing-attention Soul Grinders):

Boobthirster – Greater Daemon of Khorne

I started in on the Bloodthirsters yesterday.

I’ve never really been fond of the Bloodthirster model.  It’s dated.   It’s metal.  It’s kind of ugly.  In the planning stage for this army, I’d decided I was going to use ForgeWorld Daemon Prince model… but at Games Day they were basically giving away the metal ‘Thirster models for $10 a pop.  So, classic model it was.
Now that I’ve started painting them…. I’m starting to wish I’d stuck with the original plan.
For one, I hate metal.  It’s less cooperative and more fragile than plastic.  Plus, with the enormous wings it’s extremely top heavy.  
More significantly, the sculpt is kind of wretched.  I realized this while highlighting the flesh.  

For starters, the musculature is pretty crazy.  Like, Liefield-crazy.
Muscles and tendons aren’t quite where they should be.  I can’t tell if things are bulging veins or gills or what.
Ultimately, though: the boobs.

I had the following conversation last night:

Me: “I don’t know that I want to highlight these pecs.  They’re big… but I think that highlighting them makes them look more like boobs.

Mrs. Rushputin: “No it doesn’t.  They’re boobs.”

Me: “They’re supposed to be enormous, masculine pecs.”

Mrs. Rushputin: “Well, they look like boobs.”

Me: “Yeah, I suppose they do.”

They are pretty huge man-boobs.  It’s been better endowed by the breast fairy than the Keeper of Secrets

I’m forging ahead regardless, though.  I’ll have a more detailed status update later on.

Khornate Daemon Lists

Given that I had to bump the list up to 2K for March 20th, as well needing to swap out the Soul Grinders for… something else, I’ve done some thinking about my lists.

My 1,750 list has been unchanged.  Part of me looks at all the scary new psychic powers that these new codices have… but then the other part of me tells me that Blessing of the Blood God really wouldn’t be as useful as it should be (since it only works for wounds).

MAXIMUM KHORNAGE
Chaos Daemons – 1,750 points

HQ
Bloodthirster
Bloodthirster

Elites
Bloodcrushers x4 – Fury of Khorne, Icon of Khorne, Instrument of Khorne

Troops
Bloodletters x16 – Icon of Khorne
Bloodletters x8 – Icon of Khorne

Fast Attack
Flesh Hounds x8 – Karanak, Fury of Khorne
Flesh Hounds x8 – Fury of Khorne

Heavy Support
Soul Grinder – Phlegm
Soul Grinder – Phlegm

My 1,850 list is identical to my 1,750 list.  100 points just isn’t enough to buy another unit, so I have to throw more points at the units I have.

MAXIMUM KHORNAGE
Chaos Daemons – 1,850 points

HQ
Bloodthirster – Death Strike, Unholy Might
Bloodthirster – Death Strike, Unholy Might

Elites
Bloodcrushers x4 – Fury of Khorne, Icon of Khorne, Instrument of Khorne

Troops
Bloodletters x16 – Fury of Khorne, Icon of Khorne
Bloodletters x8 – Fury of Khorne, Icon of Khorne

Fast Attack
Flesh Hounds x8 – Karanak, Fury of Khorne
Flesh Hounds x8 – Fury of Khorne

Heavy Support
Soul Grinder – Phlegm
Soul Grinder – Phlegm

My 2,000 point list is considerably rougher.  For one, I’m swapping out the Soul Grinders with which I’m very comfortable and happy for Daemon Princes I’ve never put on the table.  Furthermore, besides the Daemon Princes, I really don’t want to add any new models: I’ve got my eye on shifting from running mono-God to something more… ecumenical, while sticking with the Khornate theme.  That will involve some fun conversions and such… none of which I’m permitting myself to think about until I’m done with this mess.

The Daemon Princes I’m not particularly happy with.  They’re loaded up with a bunch of crap that gets them up to 170 points a pop.  That’s the same cost for a Winged Daemon Prince with Iron Hide, which I think would probably be considerably more useful… but I don’t think I can run them ’cause I can’t think of a way to model them this side of ordering Tyranid Warrior Wings, which is cost-prohibitive.  Also, I’m kinda-sorta holding out for the plastic Daemon Prince kit.  I’d run them cheaper… but I don’t have anything else on which to spend the points.

So, that leaves me with:

MAXIMUM KHORNAGE
Chaos Daemons – 2,000 points

HQ
Bloodthirster – Death Strike, Unholy Might
Bloodthirster – Death Strike, Unholy Might

Elites
Bloodcrushers x4 – Fury of Khorne, Icon of Khorne, Instrument of Khorne

Troops
Bloodletters x16 – Fury of Khorne, Icon of Khorne
Bloodletters x8 – Fury of Khorne, Icon of Khorne

Fast Attack
Flesh Hounds x8 – Karanak, Fury of Khorne
Flesh Hounds x8 – Fury of Khorne

Heavy Support
Daemon Prince – Mark of Khorne, Death Strike, Instrument of Chaos, Iron Hide
Daemon Prince – Mark of Khorne, Death Strike, Instrument of Chaos, Iron Hide
Daemon Prince – Mark of Khorne, Death Strike, Instrument of Chaos, Iron Hide

There’s a lot of room for improvement with the 2K list, but it’ll get me to where I need to be for the time being and it should, hopefully, be a fun list to play.  Then, come April, it’ll be time to look to diversification.